Was all the emphasis on scoring designed for gambling on the sport?

[bunnyman666]

I have been wondering why Bettman has placed such and emphasis on scoring. Wouldn’t it make sense if gambling were to happen on the games?

I happen to think if there was a point shot (top of the circles to the blue line) that could be a two point shot. This way, scoring could increase without changing much. 
 
Do I really like this idea? No, but changing the goal size and the equipment is kinda silly IMO. 

[MTH]

It's still weird to me to think that in the span of a few years we went from betting on sports was really really bad and seedy to basically you're a POS if you don't.

[bunnyman666]

47 minutes ago, MTH said:

It's still weird to me to think that in the span of a few years we went from betting on sports was really really bad and seedy to basically you're a POS if you don't.

I just don’t like the concept of gambling on sports as the potential of cheating and changing of outcomes increases.

[seagoal]

I'm not following.  How would more scoring help with gambling?  Gambling is possible regardless of the level of scoring.

They have been fairly transparent, in a sort of diplomatic business sense, about why they want more scoring:  people who are not fans of hockey think it's boring and one of the primary reasons why is not enough scoring; they find goal scoring to be exciting. So, to get them on board......

[bunnyman666]

16 minutes ago, seagoal said:

I'm not following.  How would more scoring help with gambling?  Gambling is possible regardless of the level of scoring.

They have been fairly transparent, in a sort of diplomatic business sense, about why they want more scoring:  people who are not fans of hockey think it's boring and one of the primary reasons why is not enough scoring; they find goal scoring to be exciting. So, to get them on board......

Point spreads, etc. The way American football is set up is perfectly set up for gambling.

Edited March 31, 2022 by bunnyman666

[seagoal]

Just now, bunnyman666 said:

Point spreads, etc.

ah, so more variation in what the final scores are.  I see. 

Well, if the driver is to make it less boring for new fans, I suppose that could be one little trick.  I'd hate it, but it could work, I suppose.

[bunnyman666]

1 minute ago, seagoal said:

ah, so more variation in what the final scores are.  I see. 

Well, if the driver is to make it less boring for new fans, I suppose that could be one little trick.  I'd hate it, but it could work, I suppose.

I knew a woman who hated American Football, but loved gambling on it because of the points spreads, etc. She made lots of money gambling on American Football.

[coopaloop1234]

22 minutes ago, seagoal said:

I'm not following.  How would more scoring help with gambling?  Gambling is possible regardless of the level of scoring.

They have been fairly transparent, in a sort of diplomatic business sense, about why they want more scoring:  people who are not fans of hockey think it's boring and one of the primary reasons why is not enough scoring; they find goal scoring to be exciting. So, to get them on board......

Funny enough, soccer has officially surpassed hockey as the 4th most popular sport un the USA and soccer is almost as boring as baseball. 

I don't think it's scoring that's primarily the reason hockey isn't taking off. 

[ilyazhito]

1 hour ago, coopaloop1234 said:

Funny enough, soccer has officially surpassed hockey as the 4th most popular sport un the USA and soccer is almost as boring as baseball. 

I don't think it's scoring that's primarily the reason hockey isn't taking off. 

I think it is the niche clientele that is the top factor. The fact that you need to spend at least $1000 on a decent set of used goalie equipment prices many people out of the sport, not to mention paying for ice time, lessons, and league fees. If there is a way to make hockey more affordable and more accessible, then it will grow. That Mayor Bowser in DC balked on renovating and upgrading the Fort Dupont rink because "black people won't play hockey" is worrying for the future of the sport. We need to reach a point where K'Andre Miller, Devante Smith-Pelley, P.K. Subban, and other black NHLers become household names, and less exotic just because they are black. Get rid of the racism, make hockey accessible, and make it affordable, and you will have more interest in it. Perhaps offer a discount to ball hockey players trying ice, free gear for older beginners, not just little kids, or else have community organizations sponsor teams to pay for ice fees. We might be able to then see the next Grant Fuhr in the NHL. With players who look more like them, there might be more minorities and white people interested in hockey. 

[bunnyman666]

Another thought expanding upon popularity in hockey: Bettman knows that completely eliminating fights would alienate both current fans and potential fans that like the fights, but also eliminates another side bet possibility. Also, making more penalties makes for more power play potential, increasing scoring. 

[ilyazhito]

15 minutes ago, bunnyman666 said:

Another thought expanding upon popularity in hockey: Bettman knows that completely eliminating fights would alienate both current fans and potential fans that like the fights, but also eliminates another side bet possibility. Also, making more penalties makes for more power play potential, increasing scoring. 

I don't know. Modern fans are more aware of concussions and less likely to appreciate fighting. In European professional hockey, fighting is not as much of a thing, because fighting is an ejectable offense under IIHF rules. Perhaps that will be the future of the NHL as well.

It might also be a generational thing as well for the players, because fewer of them fight compared to players of prior years, and the number of fights per game has decreased. 

[bunnyman666]

57 minutes ago, ilyazhito said:

I don't know. Modern fans are more aware of concussions and less likely to appreciate fighting. In European professional hockey, fighting is not as much of a thing, because fighting is an ejectable offense under IIHF rules. Perhaps that will be the future of the NHL as well.

It might also be a generational thing as well for the players, because fewer of them fight compared to players of prior years, and the number of fights per game has decreased. 

I certainly will concur that fighting will eventually go away. But for so many, it is a means to rev up the fans. It’s something that is slowly leaving the game.

[The Teal Terror]

21 hours ago, coopaloop1234 said:

Funny enough, soccer has officially surpassed hockey as the 4th most popular sport un the USA and soccer is almost as boring as baseball. 

I don't think it's scoring that's primarily the reason hockey isn't taking off. 

I’m English and I hate football (soccer). North American sports are far more entertaining and more fun to play. I’ve always seen ice hockey as more of a specialist sport, both in playing and in spectating. 
 

What I take from @bunnyman666 is more of a basketball scoring system. As he mentioned, 2 points for it being shot from the point. But then again, I’m probably misunderstanding! I’m a traditionalist when it comes to sports and it’s scoring, rules, equipment etc.

Evolution in how the game is played, tweeks in existing rules regarding to play or equipment is inevitable. But major changes to the game itself seems illogical to me, personally.

[bunnyman666]

11 minutes ago, The Teal Terror said:

I’m English and I hate football (soccer). North American sports are far more entertaining and more fun to play. I’ve always seen ice hockey as more of a specialist sport, both in playing and in spectating. 
 

What I take from @bunnyman666 is more of a basketball scoring system. As he mentioned, 2 points for it being shot from the point. But then again, I’m probably misunderstanding! I’m a traditionalist when it comes to sports and it’s scoring, rules, equipment etc.

Evolution in how the game is played, tweeks in existing rules regarding to play or equipment is inevitable. But major changes to the game itself seems illogical to me, personally.

You understood correctly.

Do I like it? No, but it would make for better gambling without doing anything else to the net or the goalie equipment, as the proposals that were coming out were making gloves dangerous. With current materials and the ever evolving player stick construction, they are essentially at the peak of size/protection that they can do, save for decreasing pad width to intermediate size (10.5”). 

Edited April 1, 2022 by bunnyman666

[mr_shifty1982]

On 3/31/2022 at 12:25 PM, seagoal said:

I'm not following.  How would more scoring help with gambling?  Gambling is possible regardless of the level of scoring.

They have been fairly transparent, in a sort of diplomatic business sense, about why they want more scoring:  people who are not fans of hockey think it's boring and one of the primary reasons why is not enough scoring; they find goal scoring to be exciting. So, to get them on board......

At the same time I also don't like how they changed the game and took a 360 turn, I loved the way it was.  They did this for some of the American markets that just didn't give a shit to come out and watch.  I can understand the salary cap, 3 on 3 OT, but the game is just different.  You can still have the speed and the aggressive part of it.

[coopaloop1234]

7 minutes ago, mr_shifty1982 said:

At the same time I also don't like how they changed the game and took a 360 turn,

lol 

[MTH]

I don't watch the NHL for many reasons. The biggest is the lack of passion for the teams and the league.

I have transgender swimming as the 4th most popular sport in America in my book. Go Lia!

[bunnyman666]

37 minutes ago, MTH said:

Edited April 1, 2022 by bunnyman666

[The Teal Terror]

31 minutes ago, MTH said:

I don't watch the NHL for many reasons. The biggest is the lack of passion for the teams and the league.

I’m a big time Rögle BK fan of the SHL, watched a game last night as it’s the playoffs. The crowd was so pumped, full capacity and behind the team 100%. So much more atmospheric than the NHL is, or until it’s at least round 2 of the playoffs at least.

[Teezle]

Betting on games seems like a fast way to get a lot less enjoyment out of following any sport. Instead of "hooray my team won!" or "disappointing, but we'll try again next game" it turns into "even though we won, my team didn't score enough to cover the spread" or "my lousy team cost me $10 today!" I have never understood the appeal of it.

[bunnyman666]

25 minutes ago, Teezle said:

Betting on games seems like a fast way to get a lot less enjoyment out of following any sport. Instead of "hooray my team won!" or "disappointing, but we'll try again next game" it turns into "even though we won, my team didn't score enough to cover the spread" or "my lousy team cost me $10 today!" I have never understood the appeal of it.

Agreed 100%.
 
I have actually grown tired of a few minutes of NHL OTF for the betting lines. Just yucky.  But it just seems that this has become a lot of the focus as of late.

[MTH]

It's so forced down your throat. The broadcast companies now own their own betting apps, so I feel like I'm watching a sports betting production now. Almost like an infomercial.

RIP Billy Mays.

It's a bucket of coke.

Edited April 4, 2022 by MTH

[bunnyman666]

7 minutes ago, MTH said:

It's so forced down your throat. The broadcast companies now own their own betting apps, so I feel like I'm watching a sports betting production now. Almost like an infomercial.

RIP Billy Mays.

It's a bucket of coke.

With as much emphasis on the gambling, this is why I keep wondering about the quest for more goals. 

[seagoal]

On 4/1/2022 at 6:31 AM, ilyazhito said:

I don't know. Modern fans are more aware of concussions and less likely to appreciate fighting. In European professional hockey, fighting is not as much of a thing, because fighting is an ejectable offense under IIHF rules. Perhaps that will be the future of the NHL as well.

It might also be a generational thing as well for the players, because fewer of them fight compared to players of prior years, and the number of fights per game has decreased. 

 

On 4/1/2022 at 7:32 AM, bunnyman666 said:

I certainly will concur that fighting will eventually go away. But for so many, it is a means to rev up the fans. It’s something that is slowly leaving the game.

Fighting in the NHL is integral to one to more embarrassing jokes of a policy that they have.

Like fighting or not, I'm not arguing for or against it here. But, given all the emphasis on safety and concussions in the NHL and their rampant crack-down on illegal checks and head contact, it is absurd that they still allow fighting.

In the same period of a game, at the 5:00 mark a guy can make a body check on an opponent, UNINTENTIONALLY make contact with the opponent's head with his shoulder, and get suspended for several games for that hit.  And then, at the 7:00 mark, to avenge that hit, there can be an open fist fight where two guys repeatedly punch each other in the face and then slam each other down to the ice without helmets and all they get is a standing ovation and penalties for fighting and their own video on NHL Youtube.

It makes zero sense.

[bunnyman666]

14 minutes ago, seagoal said:

 

Fighting in the NHL is integral to one to more embarrassing jokes of a policy that they have.

Like fighting or not, I'm not arguing for or against it here. But, given all the emphasis on safety and concussions in the NHL and their rampant crack-down on illegal checks and head contact, it is absurd that they still allow fighting.

In the same period of a game, at the 5:00 mark a guy can make a body check on an opponent, UNINTENTIONALLY make contact with the opponent's head with his shoulder, and get suspended for several games for that hit.  And then, at the 7:00 mark, to avenge that hit, there can be an open fist fight where two guys repeatedly punch each other in the face and then slam each other down to the ice without helmets and all they get is a standing ovation and penalties for fighting and their own video on NHL Youtube.

It makes zero sense.

It really doesn’t when you get right down to it. If star players’ brains became porridge, I am certain there would be more emphasis to eliminate fighting. As it is, it’s not the stars (except Landeskog) throwing down. McDavid doesn’t want to ruin his manicure.