Let's Talk Skates

[bunnyman666]

I just remember that the Microns did not crack with hard shots, but the Bauer Turbo DID. The Lange were a great skate!  

Cracking was such a problem that one coach I had banned Bauer Turbo skates and clear Tuuks (which, you guessed it, also had cracking problems). 

[SaveByRichter35]

On 5/17/2017 at 1:44 PM, bunnyman666 said:

As long as nobody pines for the HORRIBLE, HORRIBLE bad Bauer impersonators called Bauer Turbo...

Hahahaha those were my first pair of ice skates except it had the black lower and grey upper.

[bunnyman666]

I skated in nothing but Graf (Swiss) back home. Sure, a few Bauer Panther and Supremes crept into ol' Blighty (as well as the occasional Tacks skate), but it was mainly Graf skates. When I came to North America, the Bauer Turbo plastic skates were all but reduced to rec players and kiddoes. And looking at Rollerblades and some rental skates, the general design still is kicking about! A few Lange boots were kicking about, as were the plastic Microns. But I had a coach who still had on his list of no-no's Bauer Turbo skates and clear Tuuks, as he did NOT want to deal with players who had broken skates during games. Every once in awhile, I would STILL see a clapper destroy a clear Tuuk or Bauer Turbo boot shatter in a game! We would lose a few minutes whilst crews would shovel up some plastic bits. 

[daffy]

Ok so keeping with my skate issue, I'm going see if I can make the Vaughn cowling work. Now I need the stiffer boot. My concern is always width (currently Graf 750 Narrow) and found a pair of Victor Fasth Bauer 6000 pro returns in a 8DA. The A being the heel. I was reading somewhere that the Graf narrow was more narrow in the heel and not much different than the regular through the rest of the foot. Can anyone verify that? If so, would you think the Bauers would fit the same?

[mik]

It is a question of what changes and modifications are made on these skates. Fatsh is known for his customizations - I have his gloves and they are really quite different from the NXG series, his leg pads are all from "another world". So suppose he make some adjustments ...

[daffy]

So need to revive the thread. I used my Bauer 6000s and they are a DA width. Felt good except the 3mm cowling. Switched it out for the Vaughn cowling which is wider than the boot. I used them a few times then the last couple of skates it feels like my right foot is colapsing inward. I was thinking maybe the boot isn't center on the cowling since the cowling is pretty wide or would it be that the skates started to break in and now are a bit too wide? I was using Graf Narrow width. Could it be my foot moving in the skate giving it a feeling like the ankle is collapsing inward? 

I think my only option is to go custom and get skates that fit the foot right.

[Harman]

Anyone have any reviews on Graf G9035 goalie skates!? 

[IPv6Freely]

12 minutes ago, Harman said:

Anyone have any reviews on Graf G9035 goalie skates!? 

Unlikely now that Graf is dead.

[SaveByRichter35]

10 hours ago, IPv6Freely said:

Unlikely now that Graf is dead.

I thought Vaughn took over Graf skates?

[IPv6Freely]

1 hour ago, SaveByRichter35 said:

I thought Vaughn took over Graf skates?

Technically yes but the industry has had enough of Grafs issues so you’re very unlikely to see them in stores even if they do manage to get the company going again. 

Theyre just delaying the inevitable.

[Chenner29]

On 11/17/2017 at 4:23 PM, daffy said:

So need to revive the thread. I used my Bauer 6000s and they are a DA width. Felt good except the 3mm cowling. Switched it out for the Vaughn cowling which is wider than the boot. I used them a few times then the last couple of skates it feels like my right foot is colapsing inward. I was thinking maybe the boot isn't center on the cowling since the cowling is pretty wide or would it be that the skates started to break in and now are a bit too wide? I was using Graf Narrow width. Could it be my foot moving in the skate giving it a feeling like the ankle is collapsing inward? 

I think my only option is to go custom and get skates that fit the foot right.

daffy -

When I worked retail I didn't really work on skates.  You sure as hell wouldn't want me running your edges through the sharpener, that's for sure.

That being said, hopefully I can chime in and offer some insight:

Sizing for cowlings is all over the map.  My 6.5R Ultra 7500s came with a 6 cowling.  My brother's 7.5Ws came with a size 6 as well.  In the past, if you were for example an 8W boot, you may end up with a 9W cowling to accommodate a bit of a wider footprint.  Now, Vaughn offers two cowling sizes across their entire spread of skate sizes. I think the sizes are 6-9, and then 9-12.   The reason is because the molds to make the plastic cowlings are very expensive so this is likely an effort to limit their expenses over anything else; since they are doing this, it is natural that they give the boots some extra width as well.  Essentially what I am trying to communicate is: since the platform for your boots is so wide on these cowlings, it is very likely your skates were mounted incorrectly, hence that wobbly feeling in your right skate.

Generally, a sloppy fit will cause more irritation/abrasion/blisters on your feet than a lack of control. 

To answer your original questions from your first post - a stiffer, composite reinforced boot will help you out a lot with that feeling of instability.  When you bend, the boot will pick up the slack. 

If you'd like, I can ship you my Ultra 7500 6.5Rs to try (just cover cost of shipping).  If you like them, we can work something out.  If you don't, just ship them back.  This way, you can try if you like the new style stiffer wall boot with a "clean factory install."  I believe the Ultra 7500 is the only skate that gearheads believe is able to accept a player style cowling like the 1S/1X because it uses basically a pirated version of Bauer's CURV composite in the sidewalls.

[daffy]

Thanks for the offer @Chenner29 but I do have a pair of Bauer 6000s which just killed my one ankle. Decided that the best thing to do is stop throwing money at skates that done fit and just do custom. Stopped by my local shop today to discuss some VH. I'm thinking I'll do it but have to see if I can back out of a pad order.

[daffy]

So quick update.  I tend to flip back and forth on what I want to do.  I have been in my old skates and the old Bauer 7000 cowlings and it is oh so good.  I think I'll stick with what has always worked and figure out something when my Graf boots totally break down.

On a side note, I checked in with Graf Canada and they will do custom Narrow width in a few of their models include the old 750 Pro Goaler.

[WillyGrips13]

Yes another thread asking for advice on skates. I wear Graf 750 Goaler Pros. I know, 1990s technology. The cowling is notorious for having a terrible attack angle, it has a large area to protect the inside of the foot and the blade is not replaceable. But I actually like them. They feel comfortable and I play well in them. I got them on closeout in 2012. Soon after I purchased them I had my skate sharpener use the crossgrinder on the protruding cowling to improve attack angle and limit slip outs.

I had a slip out on Monday that caused a groin issue. I intend to have my skate guy further crossgrind the cowling. I’ll probably get some more life out of these skates. However, I know at some point I’ll need to replace either the cowling or the entire skate. 

So what to do? I do play some stand up and although I have many elements of the modern style in my game, I’ve found I’m bringing more stand up elements back into my game including skate save movements that would expose the inside of the foot to the puck. I like cowlings on my skate and I prefer a cowling that covers the inside of the foot. I’ve gotten five years out of these skates so getting a cowling with replaceable blades is not crucial.

Should I look for 750 cowlings? If so does anyone have any leads on them? I know years ago they must’ve been plentiful because everyone was buying Graf skates and immediately replacing the cowling with Bauer and other cowlings.

Should I get another pair of these identical skates? Again, any leads on them?

I still have my Bauer 7000 Supremes I was using until I purchased the Grafs. They are on their second cowling, a generic Bauer replacement cowling. I didn’t feel totally comfortable in them, especially after I installed the replacement cowling. I felt as though I was on train tracks. I got them profiled at NoIcing Sports and it didn’t help that much. I also got the Bauer bump from these skates.

Should I rebake the Bauers and see if I can get used to them? Should I transfer these cowlings to the Grafs?

Or should I look to another brand like Vaughn?

Thanks, here are some pictures of the skates. Note the black laces broke on the Grafs during my photo shoot, so I replaced them with white laces.

[Chenner29]

Well, looking at the steel you have remaining on the Graf cowling, I'd say your slip-out was more caused by lack of steel than anything to do with the cowling.

As far as replacement options available to you, I'd say the CCM/Reebok Customlite (2 generations ago, not the newer Prolite cowling) is your best bet.
The Vaughn cowling is a decent product but know that they only make two sizes (6-8, 8.5-10) so you will have to get the blades profiled to your radius to avoid feeling flat footed.

These two are probably the most popular options for "old school" goalies who want the cowling to come up at the ball of the foot and heel.

[TheGoalNet]

Is there a budget for new skates? 

If not, I would think about the trusty old Overdrive blades connected to whichever cowling you prefer 

[WillyGrips13]

44 minutes ago, TheGoalNet said:

Is there a budget for new skates? 

If not, I would think about the trusty old Overdrive blades connected to whichever cowling you prefer 

I saw a thread that @bunnyman666 was touting them in.

1 hour ago, Chenner29 said:

Well, looking at the steel you have remaining on the Graf cowling, I'd say your slip-out was more caused by lack of steel than anything to do with the cowling.

As far as replacement options available to you, I'd say the CCM/Reebok Customlite (2 generations ago, not the newer Prolite cowling) is your best bet.
The Vaughn cowling is a decent product but know that they only make two sizes (6-8, 8.5-10) so you will have to get the blades profiled to your radius to avoid feeling flat footed.

These two are probably the most popular options for "old school" goalies who want the cowling to come up at the ball of the foot and heel.

So, you think it was the plastic at the toe making contact with the ice and not the cowling boot? Seems like that was a design flaw having the blade not go around the plastic like the Bauer.

[IPv6Freely]

Looks to me like you just need new steel. 

[WillyGrips13]

On 11/24/2017 at 9:36 PM, Chenner29 said:

As far as replacement options available to you, I'd say the CCM/Reebok Customlite (2 generations ago, not the newer Prolite cowling) is your best bet.
The Vaughn cowling is a decent product but know that they only make two sizes (6-8, 8.5-10) so you will have to get the blades profiled to your radius to avoid feeling flat footed.

The Customlites cowling doesn’t come up high enough on the inside of the boot for my liking.

@bc30, didn’t you try Vaughn skates? What would you recommend?

Also, I remember reading that Vaughn now owns Graf. Can I contact them to see if they have any Graf 750 cowlings laying around?

[daffy]

I have to agree with others, looks like you are low on steel.  I too play better in old school skates and struggle with the new style.  I use the old Bauer 7000 cowlings like in your pictures and profile to 30' radius.  Lots of blade on ice.  When I first got my Grafs, I did try the boot with the same cowling you have with a 30' radius.  Even with the bauer and graf cowling having the same profile, the graf still didn't feel right and I believe it's due to the actual length of the blade.  The Graf has a shorter blade than the Bauer, so I can see why you feel like you are on skis with them.  If you went to Vaughn cowlings, you will need to adjust to the height and also the blade is almost the same length as the old Bauers.  If you want to try them, I can work out a deal on my Vaughn cowlings I bought from Bunnyman which I won't be using.  I have been hunting high and low for a pair of Graf narrow width and all I find is regular or wide so you should be able to find some yet.  Usually the G50s come up before the 750s but they are possible to find.  Not sure what sure what size you need but there are these:

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/Graf-Pro-Goalie-skates-cowling-replacement-blades-steels-runners/152568308216?hash=item2385c7a1f8:g:pOgAAOSwcgNZLyFG  

I've been through cowlings after cowlings and have tried different set of boots this season.  I've gone back to what works, my Graf 750s in old Bauer cowlings.  I say you hunt for a new set of Graf cowlings that you know work for you.  Definitely grind down that plastic inner blade.  I've used Overdrive blades for years and love them.  Bad arthritis in the hips has caused cronic groin and adductor issues.  The OD blades have been helpful keeping me playing longer.  

[WillyGrips13]

The eBay auction looks like Bauer cowlings with Graf logos slapped on them. I’ve never seen Graf cowlings that looked like that. Even the steel comes around the plastic at the ends of the skate unlike regular Graf cowlings.

The Vaughn GX1 skates look intriguing to me. Goalie Monkey has a GX1 replacement cowling pair for $169.99.

So you advocate overdrive blades, huh?

I’m wearing size 10W in the Grafs in case you ever see a pair in your hunting.

[bunnyman666]

4 hours ago, WillyGrips13 said:

The eBay auction looks like Bauer cowlings with Graf logos slapped on them. I’ve never seen Graf cowlings that looked like that. Even the steel comes around the plastic at the ends of the skate unlike regular Graf cowlings.

The Vaughn GX1 skates look intriguing to me. Goalie Monkey has a GX1 replacement cowling pair for $169.99.

So you advocate overdrive blades, huh?

I’m wearing size 10W in the Grafs in case you ever see a pair in your hunting.

You’d be in the sweet spot for the Vaughn cowling (size 10 skate for a 8-11 cowling). 

Overdrives would help and were designed partially due to low steel. I can hook you up as I am a dealer.

[Korppi32]

Graf´s blades look like  bananas and Bauers are vice versa, it looks like there is a huge gap in the middle part of the blade.

[daffy]

22 hours ago, WillyGrips13 said:

The eBay auction looks like Bauer cowlings with Graf logos slapped on them. I’ve never seen Graf cowlings that looked like that. Even the steel comes around the plastic at the ends of the skate unlike regular Graf cowlings.

The Vaughn GX1 skates look intriguing to me. Goalie Monkey has a GX1 replacement cowling pair for $169.99.

So you advocate overdrive blades, huh?

I’m wearing size 10W in the Grafs in case you ever see a pair in your hunting.

Agreed, those Grafs are not the usual cowlings you see.  Wonder how old they are.  I've been using OD blades for years.  I even put them on the Vaughn cowlings but find I don't use them as much due to the better attack angle.  Probably in my head, but I don't want to go without them now.  Will keep an eye out for some 750s in a 10W.

[bunnyman666]

On 11/25/2017 at 1:36 AM, WillyGrips13 said:

The eBay auction looks like Bauer cowlings with Graf logos slapped on them. I’ve never seen Graf cowlings that looked like that. Even the steel comes around the plastic at the ends of the skate unlike regular Graf cowlings.

The Vaughn GX1 skates look intriguing to me. Goalie Monkey has a GX1 replacement cowling pair for $169.99.

So you advocate overdrive blades, huh?

I’m wearing size 10W in the Grafs in case you ever see a pair in your hunting.

Those are old ICM cowlings. Very traditional in the sense of a traditional cowling with moulded-in blade; probably the first of it’s kind.  They are so old that possibly they were from the days that hardly any skate companies produced their own cowlings and holders. Tuuk and ICM produced most of the cowlings and holders with CCM making a few on occasion, along with the rare and highly advanced blue Perfekta. But skate companies rarely supplied their own holders, as you would find Tuuk on CCM and Lange, Tuuk and ICM on Bauers, Perfektas or Tuuk on Daoust, etc., etc. Sometimes you could open three boxes and find different holders on the same model skate!

 Skate technology moved very, very slowly for so long, though in the last 25 years it has progressed relatively quickly! The only thing that would pre-date these were from back when the cowling was separate from the all-steel blade that you mounted on the boot with the cowling between it! I estimate these to be from the ‘90s. 

Through this diatribe I hope that I get across that there wasn’t a holder or cowling produced for a skate back in the day! So they could, in theory be a “Graf” cowling with a factory sticker, but were actually ICM. I recognise many traits from seriously old stuff! 

Yep- now I know why it is thought to be a “Bauer” cowling, as the ICM was also labelled “Bauer”, as well:

https://www.hockeyworld.com/ICM-Goal-Cowling-Senior-Pair