Middle split - Genetics or training?

[dstew29]

Every goalie in here wants to have this one in the tool box, but I’ve always been curious to know if most of could even achieve it.

like any other difficult endeavor, I’m sure it’s a daily routine for 6 or longer months before you even get close to seeing good results, but curious to know:

1) Anyone attempt training for this with success? And is so, what method did you use? YouTube video, etc. (A lot of advice out there but hard to say which ones are most effective)

2) Anyone train for this with a full effort and not get the result? 

[Lucky Pucker]

21 minutes ago, dstew29 said:

Every goalie in here wants to have this one in the tool box, but I’ve always been curious to know if most of could even achieve it.

like any other difficult endeavor, I’m sure it’s a daily routine for 6 or longer months before you even get close to seeing good results, but curious to know:

1) Anyone attempt training for this with success? And is so, what method did you use? YouTube video, etc. (A lot of advice out there but hard to say which ones are most effective)

2) Anyone train for this with a full effort and not get the result? 

Not sure what “middle splits” is... Are you talking about this kind of thing?

 

If so, I don’t see this as being important for a beer leaguer. Overall flexibility, absolutely! But a goal of splits...? I don’t get it.

I mean, even if the argument is that you can cover post-to-post when the puck carrier is behind the net, I’d argue that you’re stuck/frozen there. I’m pretty sure I’ve seen Saros burnt that way, being a smaller goalie especially.

And in the above Holtby pic, that’s a desperation reaction save by a flexible goalie, not a technique. Like, I don’t think any goaltending school is teaching “now in this situation, go into your splits...”
 Am I maybe missing something...?

[dstew29]

27 minutes ago, Lucky Pucker said:

Not sure what “middle splits” is... Are you talking about this kind of thing?

 

If so, I don’t see this as being important for a beer leaguer. Overall flexibility, absolutely! But a goal of splits...? I don’t get it.

I mean, even if the argument is that you can cover post-to-post when the puck carrier is behind the net, I’d argue that you’re stuck/frozen there. I’m pretty sure I’ve seen Saros burnt that way, being a smaller goalie especially.

And in the above Holtby pic, that’s a desperation reaction save by a flexible goalie, not a technique. Like, I don’t think any goaltending school is teaching “now in this situation, go into your splits...”
 Am I maybe missing something...?

Yeah I hear you but I think you missed my point. To me, middle split is sort of the ergonomic end of that flexibility range. Better flexibility is great for life and even better for goalies if they care about injury prevention. I’d also think better flexibility in that range would lead to better save selections - and no, not just referring to the full split desperation kind. But butterfly, getting your leg to the post on breakaways, wrap arounds, cross ice passes, etc.

Having full middle split as the goal will just bring you to a natural end range I’d think, maybe not a full split but probably way better than your previous range. That’s all I’m saying. Why train for anything less as a “goal”?

That Holtby / Saros/ Quick type save looks cool but it’s not something I’d use often - if I could even do it.

PS - I think average Joe/Jane yoga trainers all practice to do this move so not crazy to think non elite NHL goalies would want/be able to do it. Just a long haul for most of us who only stretch 15/20 mins before games

[Lucky Pucker]

35 minutes ago, dstew29 said:

Yeah I hear you but I think you missed my point. To me, middle split is sort of the ergonomic end of that flexibility range. Better flexibility is great for life and even better for goalies if they care about injury prevention. I’d also think better flexibility in that range would lead to better save selections - and no, not just referring to the full split desperation kind. But butterfly, getting your leg to the post on breakaways, wrap arounds, cross ice passes, etc.

 

Having full middle split as the goal will just bring you to a natural end range I’d think, maybe not a full split but probably way better than your previous range. That’s all I’m saying. Why train for anything less as a “goal”?

That Holtby / Saros/ Quick type save looks cool but it’s not something I’d use often - if I could even do it.

PS - I think average Joe/Jane yoga trainers all practice to do this move so not crazy to think non elite NHL goalies would want/be able to do it. Just a long haul for most of us who only stretch 15/20 mins before games

Ok, I think it was me not understanding the “middle splits” terminology (and I’m still not sure I do - LOL!) As I said though, all for overall flexibility - and as you said, that’s just good for life in general! I stretch every night and use the foam roller, and am convinced that it has helped me stave off injury - which at 41, is very important!

Cheers!

[seagoal]

There's a good argument to be made that not everyone is capable of this.  There has to be a significant amount of room and flexibility in the hip joint for this to be possible.  

There are people who could do it but can't right now because they haven't trained for it and don't need to.

There are people who can not do even if they trained to do it and need....want...to. 

Maria Mountain, an amazing goalie-specific body trainer in Ontario, has warned of this for years over and over.  She argues adamently that not everyone has the genetics--->body to do this and training for it/trying to do it can lead to serious pain and injury.  

Think about how many goalies in the NHL actually do it...at all.  The whole lot of them are the most highly trained, skilled goalies on the planet and I bet the majority of them can not do it.  Why would the majority of people who's job it is to be a goalie NOT do this?  They can't and/or don't need to. 

[ThatCarGuy]

First of all I’d like to apologize. I’m not the best with words. 
So to answer your question, middle splits is both genetics and training. Genetics make it much easier and allow you to have better middle splits but I most certainly do not have those genes and I trained my way to it. I can do middle splits on ice and it’s a ton of fun but it took a long time to get here. Knowing a few people who do cheer and dance team at their schools has helped me a ton. 
When training to get middle splits don’t just work on middle splits, work on stretching out everything because I know from experience yes middle splits are great and stop tons of pucks but if the muscles right next to those you stretched out then you will inevitably pull something.
Working on a wider butterfly flare has also helped my splits immensely. The two seem to go hand in hand. 

This is my butterfly flare. Notice how my toes are pointed more upwards than at the ice. You want to do the same thing in your splits to avoid hip impingement. 

That probably made no sense but there it is

[dstew29]

@Lucky Pucker @seagoal @ThatCarGuy got all viewpoints here, thank you!

For me, I’ve always wanted to be more flexible in net (who doesn’t) but never gave it a full effort. My world won’t be crushed if I can’t ever do it but I love a challenge!

@ThatCarGuy if you have some routine to post that helped you, I’d definitely take a look as I’m sure others might too. Looks like you’ve put in the time yourself so kudos!

[ThatCarGuy]

@dstew29 this is roughly two years worth of work but my stretching was far from intense and I didn’t put as much time into it as I could.

Most of my stretching was done on ice because that’s when I had time and because ice allows you to get into deeper stretches more easily. Heres a few stretches I do off ice though

 

Along with those stretches I try to push my left and right splits (one leg in front and one leg behind) further to keep everything even so if I roll out of middle splits I don’t pull anything by accident. 

I will update this when I find or take better pictures later

[DL42]

do hip stretches for sake of health not for goaltending it'll be more benificial.,, that is what u should google on youtube.  

having a proper fitness workout should should hit all the areas  the 90/90 hip stretches and everything else.

you also need the strength and agility to get out of that  as well.