True 2 piece resurrection

[ser33]

Hello again

as I mentioned in my topic of homemade composite skates

when they were ready, I managed to buy a True 2 piece of my size very cheaply

since in this topic I will often mention the previous topic, including the video that I posted there, I will leave this link to it

the skates were in the "patient is more dead than alive" state

But has it ever stopped me? lol

here are some pictures from the seller and my skates upon arrival

skates were on CCM holders. one blade was shattered

they weighed over a kilogram

mostly because of the holders

I refused such holders when making homemade skates, True will also have a Vertex holder

boots without holders, laces, tongues and insoles weigh 492 grams, which is already very pleasing

condition was age appropriate. the leather of the side panels was worn

everything was much worse inside - the Clarino liner was practically absent, and the foam also got

instead of soles there were scraps of some paper

I will talk about this "paper" in more detail in the next part.

I'm not a big connoisseur of the True range, but I assume this is one of the early 2 piece models that were made to order and not supplied at retail. if i'm wrong please correct me

if this is really custom, then I'm very lucky, because the skates fit me perfectly. Of course, not like the ones I made from the cast of the foot, but very good.

to be continued...

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 15, 2023 by ser33

[creasecollector]

Dang, those skates were in rough shape. Hope you can turn them into to something usable. Glad I dry my boots after every skate.... Doesn't look like the previous user took care of their skates as nice as they could have...

[ser33]

9 hours ago, creasecollector said:

Dang, those skates were in rough shape. Hope you can turn them into to something usable. Glad I dry my boots after every skate.... Doesn't look like the previous user took care of their skates as nice as they could have...

something tells me that the previous users were far from alone)) the problems of the internal part are not only and not so much from poor care (although this is not excluded). I will tell you about it soon

[ser33]

the most interesting part for me is how is it made?

in the last topic, I showed how skates of the lower price category are made. now I'll show you how to make custom skates for a thousand dollars

From a video tour of the True Skate Factory, we know that the toe cap and side panel are glued to the composite boot with conventional shoe manufacturing glue.

so rebuffing the seams connecting the liner and the side panel, I easily removed them

and expected to see a beautiful carbon shell there

and I saw...

the fact is that custom skates are made from several pieces of carbon glued to the foot model

and it would seem that everything would be fine if these pieces overlapped each other. but in reality there were gaps between the pieces with some kind of white base

which in appearance was a fabric with a very rare weave and naturally did not have the strength of carbon fiber, which led to its split

in appearance, it resembled the so-called "sacrificial fabric" used in the manufacture of composites to absorb excess resin. the screenshots from the video above show that something similar is used by True for the production of skates. it is on this white base that the layers of carbon are glued

but why did it remain uncoated in my case? it's a mystery to me

stripes of dry, non-resin-impregnated carbon fiber were visible on the sides

having a suspiciously regular even shape. and next to them are pieces of paper, which turned out to be ordinary masking tape / paper tape - whoever is more accustomed to call

in the manufacture of composites, masking tape is used as a fastening of the edges of the carbon blank before it is impregnated with resin, since the carbon threads are not fastened by anything and the blank quickly crumbles into threads, losing its shape. or as a separating layer, since the resin does not adhere well to paper

in this case, the first option takes place when pieces of carbon were applied with edges fastened with masking tape. and then they simply "forgot" to remove it and the carbon was not saturated with resin. wtf? how is that even possible???

but that's not all. painter's tape was also used here in the second option - as a separator between the foot model and the composite boot (it can be seen on the screen below)

as well as the use of masking tape to fasten the edges of the carbon blank

and judging by the photo of my skates below, they also "forgot" to take it off

he was everywhere. throughout the interior

masking tape even became part of the design, replacing carbon, which was missing

draw your own conclusions

in addition to these "nuances", the boots had carbon fiber splits in the front

moreover, the last photos show that this part was subjected to grinding - presumably that cap did not "fall into place" which thinned the carbon in these places and led to its breakdown over time

the carbon from the side parts from the eyelet area generally peeled off and was torn off by me. underneath it was...

ordinary PE plastic

a close look at the production video of the skates showed that True was using plastic to reinforce the heavily stressed area of the grommets. and I don't see anything wrong with that.

carbon coated plastic

and the bad thing is that, like masking tape, PE plastic has poor adhesion with resin and over time, the carbon simply peels off from it, which happened. even perforation of plastic will not save for better penetration of the resin into it

something like that...

despite this, I still consider True skates of this design to be the most "advanced" and after their restoration I will be happy to use them

to be continued...

 

finally a few more photos not included in the text

Edited August 18, 2023 by ser33

[ArdeFIN]

Either the build quality is close to none and these are not made overseas right?

Or there is a lot in the design and structure that we don't know about.

Ofcourse nothing lasts forever and these boots have overlasted that limit a long time ago... 

But still pretty sure that the previous owner will have an "Ohhh!" feeling when he gets to use his next intact skates that are firm and supportive.

You can tell a lot from the first pictures from inside the heel where there is a lot of abrasion. And these skates are famous for the good heel lock right?

[ser33]

35 minutes ago, ArdeFIN said:

Either the build quality is close to none and these are not made overseas right?

Or there is a lot in the design and structure that we don't know about.

Ofcourse nothing lasts forever and these boots have overlasted that limit a long time ago... 

But still pretty sure that the previous owner will have an "Ohhh!" feeling when he gets to use his next intact skates that are firm and supportive.

You can tell a lot from the first pictures from inside the heel where there is a lot of abrasion. And these skates are famous for the good heel lock right?

As far as I know from multiple sources, the custom skates were made exclusively at the factory in Winnipeg. and yes, you are right, the build quality of these particular skates is zero. and the "nuances" shown by me are not a consequence of operational wear, but a disgusting assembly.
as for the heel lock, it is really excellent. better than the bauer and almost as good as my homemade skates. ha ha. As for the high wear of the foam, it is not only in the heel area, I believe that the point is also that these skates were not made for the previous owner and did not fit him perfectly. judging by the amount of wear, I guess there were a lot of owners

about rigidity and support.
surprisingly, it is excellent.

Edited August 19, 2023 by ser33

[creasecollector]

Thanks for the updates! The carnage on those things though...

[ser33]

start repairing shoes

the sole had many holes due to the installation of various holders, which lost their shape and collapsed. also the sole was very thin and could not hold the rivets firmly

using the most important and necessary material for each manufacturer of custom composite skates - masking tape, I sealed the holes from the bottom

filled the holes with resin and glued pieces of fiberglass, making the sole thicker and stronger

cleaning out all the paper

I also glued pieces to problem areas where the carbon fiber cracked - inside and out, strengthening them

in fact, the resin is transparent and the fiberglass is white. using a toner for resin, I achieved the effect of "carbon look" so that the patches would not stand out much, although these places will be hidden - I just wanted to))

after drying, I carefully sanded the edges of the patches, paying special attention to the inner ones, so that they would not later protrude and move

remembering my problems with homemade skates when they rubbed my foot with their hard edges, and also considering the experience of True, who cuts out the side on new models

I did also. pasted magic masking tape, defined a new contour of the top edge

and cut

after which, using adhesive tape as a template, I transferred the contour to the second shoe, making them the same

to be continued...

 

Edited August 21, 2023 by ser33

[ser33]

it's time for sewing. i love to sew. I sew almost all of my gear by hand. but recently I bought a sewing machine, so now I do some of the work on it.

even at the first fitting, I really liked the True tongues. thick, dense, well-fitting leg. they are made according to the "classic" technology - felt and top decorative trim. and if the felt was in good condition, better than the felt of the Bauer tongues I used for my homemade skates, then the top trim was quite worn

Velcro was also out of order.

separating the top from the felt, I saw that between them there are two more layers of foam - soft and medium density

True tongues are longer than I'm used to. this is due to the fact that the Velcro fastening to the boot allows you to change the length of the tongue by "lowering" it down into the toe cap. which increases toe protection and removes negative space. I tried it and realized it's not for me. the toes were cramped, the tongue pressed too hard on them. so it needs to be shortened. At the same time, I liked the Velcro fastening itself. leave him

cut off the felt

separating the torn parts, cut off the top trim

sewed on a new velcro

in the upper part I also sewed a loop of nylon slings. just in case. let it be))

transferred the complex shape of the tongue to a new material

cut and sew it

and on the other side

as you can see in the first photo, the greatest wear was in the middle lateral parts - places where the tongue rubs against the eyelets of the boot the most

to protect these places, I sewed on pieces of thin soft leather, as is done, including on the tongues of True skates of new generations

ready

I sewed the felt and the top by hand, because due to the nature of my sewing machine and the lack of protruding edges of the felt on my machine, this was impossible to do

to be continued...

[ser33]

after the tongues, I replaced the Velcro with toe caps

my sewing machine can sew plastic, which is very pleasing

ready

the leather on the side panels has been worn off

cut off

cut new pieces out of the skin. I did not have large pieces of leather that would allow me to cut out whole pieces of such a complex shape, so I made them in two parts. this is what most manufacturers do to save material. then sewed into place

and sewed the side panels to toe caps

on the wrong side of the side panels was found ...

never guess

masking tape

Apparently he stuck there with a boot

build quality? no, have not heard

to be continued...

 

[ser33]

it's time to glue. Here we go

the liner was completely torn apart and almost destroyed.

replacing it is not a problem. the problem was that the foam under the liner was also destroyed in places

so you have to make new foam

but the main problem was that these skates were made for a specific foot. not my foot. and the foam used in them was very thin. the foam I usually use is 4mm. True foam is much thinner, about 2mm. I didn't have one like that. speaking of Foam True - I really liked it, soft and elastic at the same time, it resembles rubber

in production, the foam is glued onto a liner wrapped around the molded foot, layer by layer. then all this is glued into the boot with one element

I will have to glue each layer separately, as if from the outside to the inside, where the liner will become the last layer

the problem with the foam of the desired thickness was suddenly resolved. Even when I wanted a homemade Bauer Konekt I bought old skates of a similar design. who would have thought that their liners would have foam of the required thickness, and even so perfectly preserved

the main target was "do no harm", so I tried to copy the original exactly

the first layer was the back in the shape of a semicircle

cut out a similar piece and glued

then the same thing but outside the boot

after I cut the True foam in half and transferred its outline to my foam

having received such a set of pieces

and pasted into boots

made of softer foam that will take shape better when baked made the ankle

True's noses are known to have bits of foam in them to keep their toes from touching the composite shell

from the experience of using my homemade skates, I know the usefulness of this solution and repeated it

at the same time, both True and my homemade skates did not have foam on the sides of the toes and my experience decided that this was wrong. which was fixed, the foam is glued around the entire perimeter of the boot

for the liner I bought tight jersey

its thickness made it possible to hope for greater durability, and its elasticity allowed it to be reliably glued to a very complex foam relief

tucked the edges of the liner and glued it on the outside of the boot

how it's done by True

By the way, in the previous photo you can see a little red True foam glued to the toe of the boot from the outside. the fact is that when connecting the boot and toe cap, I found that there is a gap between them. for a snug fit toe cap to the toe of the boot, I glued this foam, which will give additional protection to the toes

I refused to "lower" the tongues in the toe cap due to their excessive thickness putting pressure on the toes. but I didn’t refuse the very idea of additional protection of the toes from above and neutralization of the negative space and stuck my 4mm foam from the inside on the top of the toe cap

work is moving towards completion.

to be continued...

 

Edited August 31, 2023 by ser33

[TheGoalNet]

Fascinating topic, love the pics, keep us posted

[ser33]

glued toe cap with side panels on the boot and sewed with the liner through the boot

glued the heel pad in place. I still didn’t understand its purpose, apparently a purely design decision, which also raises the heel above the holder by about 1 mm, making a landing with a large forward inclination

for many years I have not used the boot strap and, accordingly, I do not use the Lundi loop

so I did not replace the piece with Lundi's loop

leaving open space with lots of pure carbon

an attentive eye could notice in the photo from the previous post the captive nuts in the boot

as well as the fact that when replacing parts of the side panels, I made the pieces of leather longer than they were

now they began to go on toe cap and close pairs of holes for the lower eyelets

yes, yes, I decided to abandon the laces. I really liked the experience of using homemade skates with buckles instead of laces. and the point is not only in the speed of putting on / taking off, but above all in the possibility of fine adjustment of the degree of tightening. Literally online.)

so another buckle donor was bought

again, the experience of using homemade skates showed that due to the rigidity of their boot, one buckle in the middle of the boot on the bend of the leg is enough. she tightened both the bottom and the top giving unsurpassed mobility of the leg when bending forward

the main significant drawback of this was that the entire load from the leg went to a single buckle and the pressure from it on the leg increased greatly, which led to discomfort. at the same time, the upper part of the boot of homemade skates was noticeably stiffer than the upper part of the True boot

so I decided to make two attachment points like on Konekt

by moving the lower buckle lower

and for the upper part using a strap like in Konekt

for this I took a strap from donor ski boots, cut it

removed someone else's logo and replaced the Velcro

I immediately abandoned the top buckle like on Konekt because it was extra weight, I didn’t have a buckle with such a short loop and I didn’t see the advantage of using a buckle there because the Velcro fixed it perfectly and also allowed me to change the degree of tightening

then screwed the upper strap onto the boot

it turned out like this

note how wonderfully the chrome buckle harmonizes with the VH logo haha

to be continued...

 

[creasecollector]

Very cool, another great post. Interesting choice with the buckles as well. Seems like the future for all goalie skates maybe at some point.

[ser33]

boots are ready, it's time to install the holders. I have been using Vertexx holders for many years now and have become accustomed to them. True will also be like this. I bought a couple of these in reserve when making homemade skates

as I said, the carbon in the sole is very thin and will not be able to securely hold the rivets. they will loosen over time and the carbon will collapse around the holes

you will have to reinforce the sole with a plastic sheet, as I did on homemade skates

the True heel is already reinforced with plastic, but the forefoot is not

I took a suitable sheet of plastic about 1.5 mm thick and traced the outline of the front of the sole on it

cut out

cut out for arch supports

I use solid aluminum rivets which are much cheaper than similar copper rivets and are stronger than the semi-hollow steel rivets commonly used by skate manufacturers and do not rust like steel

they do not bite like steel because they have a flat hat

installed holders

This is my second pair of skates that I have installed holders on myself. and only on the second skate of the second pair did I manage to do this not only reliably, but also more or less aesthetically. lol. there is progress, skill is growing

Well, here's what it looks like in the end

it was

so it became

in total they weigh 1086 grams

but it was 1057 grams

the miracle did not happen, but one should take into account the heavy massive buckles and the overall reinforcement of the boot during the repair

I'm not very surprised or upset because I already knew from reviews that custom True skates weigh a lot

homemade skates weighed 987 grams

S29 932 grams

you feel this difference in weight when holding the skates in your hands, but you don’t feel it on your feet on the ice

to be continued...

[Hockey34]

8 hours ago, ser33 said:

boots are ready, it's time to install the holders. I have been using Vertexx holders for many years now and have become accustomed to them. True will also be like this. I bought a couple of these in reserve when making homemade skates

as I said, the carbon in the sole is very thin and will not be able to securely hold the rivets. they will loosen over time and the carbon will collapse around the holes

you will have to reinforce the sole with a plastic sheet, as I did on homemade skates

the True heel is already reinforced with plastic, but the forefoot is not

I took a suitable sheet of plastic about 1.5 mm thick and traced the outline of the front of the sole on it

cut out

cut out for arch supports

I use solid aluminum rivets which are much cheaper than similar copper rivets and are stronger than the semi-hollow steel rivets commonly used by skate manufacturers and do not rust like steel

they do not bite like steel because they have a flat hat

installed holders

This is my second pair of skates that I have installed holders on myself. and only on the second skate of the second pair did I manage to do this not only reliably, but also more or less aesthetically. lol. there is progress, skill is growing

Well, here's what it looks like in the end

it was

so it became

in total they weigh 1086 grams

but it was 1057 grams

the miracle did not happen, but one should take into account the heavy massive buckles and the overall reinforcement of the boot during the repair

I'm not very surprised or upset because I already knew from reviews that custom True skates weigh a lot

homemade skates weighed 987 grams

S29 932 grams

you feel this difference in weight when holding the skates in your hands, but you don’t feel it on your feet on the ice

to be continued...

What kind of steel is that?

[ser33]

15 hours ago, Hockey34 said:

What kind of steel is that?

BVS. Ice Hockey Goalie Blades Compatible with TUUK EDGE Holders. Country of origin: Russia. Material High carbon stainless steel. Hardness: 46-50 HRS. Thickness: 2.93mm.

Geometrically comparable to LS5G + 4mm

I got them for a very good price of $40 including shipping (new) and recently ordered another one

Edited September 8, 2023 by ser33

[Hockey34]

8 hours ago, ser33 said:

BVS. Ice Hockey Goalie Blades Compatible with TUUK EDGE Holders. Country of origin: Russia. Material High carbon stainless steel. Hardness: 46-50 HRS. Thickness: 2.93mm.

Geometrically comparable to LS5G + 4mm

I got them for a very good price of $40 including shipping (new) and recently ordered another one

Where do you get them from?

[ser33]

17 hours ago, Hockey34 said:

Where do you get them from?

I am from Russia. no problem getting them here

[Hockey34]

6 hours ago, ser33 said:

I am from Russia. no problem getting them here

Ok that makes sense because I can’t find it anywhere online here

[ser33]

16 minutes ago, Hockey34 said:

Ok that makes sense because I can’t find it anywhere online here

I receive them in Russia without any problems, but I cannot deliver them to North America

[Hockey34]

39 minutes ago, ser33 said:

I receive them in Russia without any problems, but I cannot deliver them to North America

I probably just can’t find them because of Bauer and there patients with their steel

[ser33]

this will probably be the most difficult part of the story because I will need to find the right words to describe my feelings and try to compare True with other skates

Comparing True with S29 makes no sense since these skates are at two different poles. primarily technologically. if I had transferred from S29 directly to True, then the whole comparison would have come down to one word - Wow! but in front of True there were homemade skates and everything is not so simple here

upon completion of the work, I baked them using Mr. Van Horne’s technology

 

so first skating

before going out on the ice I fastened them (as it seemed to me) relatively tightly

but composite skates, and this includes my homemade skates, have one very amazing ability (true skate owners confirm, I often read about this ability in reviews of users of these skates).

This ability lies in the fact that “in the cold” when you put on your skates, they fit on your feet with great difficulty and seem very tight, sometimes they even pinch, although you baked them correctly.

but literally after 10-15 minutes of riding they seem to soften and re-fit the leg, reducing all discomfort to zero.

I still don’t understand how and why this happens. this happened with my homemade skates, this also happened with True

They became looser, so I had to remove the pads and fasten the skates tighter. After that the skating went smoothly.

despite the baking, the Trues were felt on the foot as something alien, that is, the brain understood that they were wearing skates on their feet. This is not surprising, since this is a custom model that does not fit my foot. but there was no particular discomfort. on the contrary, which surprised me, given the presence of very thin foam in the padding of the boot (twice as thin as in homemade skates), I felt comfortable

not as comfortable as in homemade skates, but definitely more comfortable than in Bauer. of course, because the homemade skates were made from a cast of my foot. and here homemade 10 out of 10, True 8 out of 10

it gave a certain pride that a simple guy could make skates no worse (technically) than an entire company with a big name.

The feeling of foreignness was primarily influenced by the so-called “landing” (I don’t know how to say it correctly in English) - the position of the leg in the skate relative to the ice. which was not very clear to me, since I used the same Vertexx holder of the same size as on the S29 and on the homemade skates. but it definitely felt different.

overall the ice session went almost perfectly and the skates didn’t interfere much

what did I understand.

True's boots are definitely softer than homemade ones. at the same time, in the lower part they are similarly rigid, but the upper part above the ankle and the eyelet area is much more “pliable” than on my homemade ones. This is understandable if we remember the structure of True, where in the area of the eyelets PE plastic was used, which has little connection with the main part of the boot and is itself softer than the composite, and in the upper part above the ankle there was generally something obscure that did not contribute to rigidity.

not having True on hand when making homemade skates, not knowing the real features of True’s boot, afraid of messing up, I made the entire homemade boot with the same stiffness in all zones. and it turned out to be stiffer than True's boot as a result.

the use of two fastening points (as on Konekt) on True's boots, precisely because of their uneven rigidity, showed excellent results instead of using one buckle on stiffer homemade skates

The first ride showed the presence of a huge (as it seemed then) space in the toe caps. and it doesn't matter that I glued foam there everywhere around my toes. the second sensation was that the foot was “sliding” forward and the toes were resting on the front wall of the shoe

I decided to remove the excess free space the old way - insert another insole (initially there were two of them in Truya). This insole was made very simply - I cut it out of linoleum)) by the way, a very useful life hack, time-tested. Initially, the outer layer of linoleum is very hard and wear-resistant, it is placed face down on the rivets and perfectly eliminates the bites of the rivets, and the soft layer of linoleum gives comfort

 

second skating

It has already become better and the linoleum insole has made the position of the foot in the skate more dense

but did not eliminate the “slipping” of the foot forward. which is understandable, since the thickness of the insoles has increased over the entire area. it was necessary to increase the thickness of the insole in the front part, changing the angle of the foot in the boot. but there was nowhere to increase it. then I took out the extra insole and instead glued a piece of foam to the front of the main insole, just like I did on the homemade skates. and it worked. the third ride went without any problems

 

to summarize.

It was a very interesting experience, although slightly "distorted" by the earlier production of composite skates from scratch, but overall, it was very interesting to restore True's skates to working condition. Perhaps in the process I will have more to say about them, but that’s all for now.

Thanks to everyone who read and commented.

 

 

 

Edited September 11, 2023 by ser33

[tubby34]

Dude, this is incredible.

[creasecollector]

Job well done! Those "after" shots look great!