Stiffer Knee stacks making 5 hole closure worse.

[Jonathon v]

Hey guys, I've had stock gnetik 3 pads for like 6 months about. The seal has been pretty good, usually pucks cant squeak by, but I wanted my 5 hole to be perfect. Anyways, I know skate lace as a toe tie can affect 5 hole closure, so I have been using pro laces. Love them. Stock boot taper for gnet 3 (80 or 84 degrees I think) My knee stacks for them are medium stock (Im pretty sure, def not stiff)My stiff knee stacks arrived today, I took my old ones out of the Velcro tabs, put in the new ones. I honestly didn't notice that it slid better (Brians rep said better sliding as per less compression) Also, 5 hole seal got worse. Pucks can now squeak by, I tested this out at my practice tonight. Do they need time to break in, or what? I was talking about the toe ties and boot taper because I know those can affect 5 hole seal, and I don't think it's those. Can someone help please. 

This is mainly about the 5 hole seal, but does it even help slide a bit better. Like If It doesn't help with seal or sliding, whats the purpose of them?

[Max27]

The stiffer knee stack will give you more height, stability, and due to less compression, should help them slide better. Are you sure you put the new knee stacks in right?

[Jonathon v]

2 hours ago, Max27 said:

The stiffer knee stack will give you more height, stability, and due to less compression, should help them slide better. Are you sure you put the new knee stacks in right?

I can put a picture in, give me a second

[Jonathon v]

6 minutes ago, Jonathon v said:

I can put a picture in, give me a second

[Max27]

looks like its in their right,  its probably just the adjustment period of the much stiffer knee setup. Ive heard theres a drastic difference between the hard knee block and the stock "medium soft"

@TheGoalNet I know you had the stock medium in your Optiks, and now you have the stiff in your genetik IVs. Did you notice anything like this?

[Jonathon v]

Just like to add this  me sitting  in my butterfly before I get on the ice, I know that’s what a stick isn’t for, but I still want that great seal I can get my finger through there, and a puck can fit through too 

[Max27]

Alex at the top of the sc made me crack up lol 

back on topic- not sure if that torque in the thigh would be caused by directly the knee stack, could just be torsional flex in the pad, like this

[Jonathon v]

1 hour ago, Max27 said:

Alex at the top of the sc made me crack up lol 

back on topic- not sure if that torque in the thigh would be caused by directly the knee stack, could just be torsional flex in the pad, like this

lol sorry about that if I get a Snapchat I just ignore them. Also are u sure it’s the torsional flex, I really want to fix this problem. I should be keeping my stick there but just for that odd shot I don’t get my stick on. I really want to fix this. Also I don’t really make the strapping very tight, it’s pretty loose and they are all elastic and Velcro straps

[mufforz]

I to also believe it's the torsional flex in the pad. I had ccm retro flex and had this same issue....Ive seen it in almost all "soft" pads while stiffer pads seel the ice.  I'm in optiks now and they sit flush

[Max27]

3 hours ago, Jonathon v said:

lol sorry about that if I get a Snapchat I just ignore them. Also are u sure it’s the torsional flex, I really want to fix this problem. I should be keeping my stick there but just for that odd shot I don’t get my stick on. I really want to fix this. Also I don’t really make the strapping very tight, it’s pretty loose and they are all elastic and Velcro straps

haha dw about it im 15 (i think u said u play bantam so were the same age) we all do the same shit 

and yea i think it could be torsional flex, but i think u should try reaching out to brians if you want a definitive answer, any answer youll get on here is very much just speculations 

[Jonathon v]

@TheGoalNet   I too am curious to hear what you have to say as you had medium knee stacks on a pad with  little to no torsional flex  (optik) and stiff ones on the gnetik 4 which has lots of it

[Jonathon v]

  Another follow up, I was checking them without any pressure on them, so basically the pads laying in the butterfly on my floor, and they had a great  5 hole seal, I put my knee in 1 of the pads, but very close to the top of the knee stack, basically very close to the top of the pad, and the seal seemed good still. Keeping in mind, my leg wasn't in the pad or strapped, and My leg wasn't even in the pad at all, I was just testing the knee. So it seems they seal better when my knee is higher up. They are 34+1 and im 5 foot 7 or 5 foot 8.

Ill put some pics up in a second

[Jonathon v]

      

 

 

 So the 2 with the perfect seal are when NOT on my leg. Other 2 pictures is the pad on my leg, as you can see there is a gap, and it is a little bit worse when I have my kneeguards on (Which I don't because I was in my house)

[Max27]

where do you land on the block, in terms of how far away/close you are relative from the face of the pad ? leaning far too back in the knee block could have you pull the thigh back 

Heres a pic of what i mean-

jaro leaning foward so much on the pad is causing it to rotate foward( look at his right pad, aka your left

[Jonathon v]

5 minutes ago, Max27 said:

where do you land on the block, in terms of how far away/close you are relative from the face of the pad ? leaning far too back in the knee block could have you pull the thigh back 

Heres a pic of what i mean-

jaro leaning foward so much on the pad is causing it to rotate foward( look at his right pad, aka your left

The 34 plus 1 is a bit big on me but I’m growing into it. My knee is about halfway up the knee stacks 

[Max27]

11 minutes ago, Jonathon v said:

The 34 plus 1 is a bit big on me but I’m growing into it. My knee is about halfway up the knee stacks 

yea i can imagine them being a little big, i use 34 + 1 also and im 6'2 lol 

and about the stack, not sure what it could be then. Like i said, Probably just check with Brians if you want a definitive answer

[Chenner29]

Based on what you have posted, if your pads sit perfectly by themselves and the thighs are pulling up and away from the ice a bit when you’re in them, I would say it’s because the pads are too big for you. You’re probably landing in the bottom 1/4 of the knee block with all your gear on. 

I’m not familiar with how the blocks install, but can you install them at an angle? Ramp them a bit so the top of the block is closer to the ice and the bottom is a bit further away. This might help offset some of your weight distribution.

get a couple measurements while you’re at it:

 - mid ankle to mid knee along outside of your leg

 - along the backside of your pad, start at the middle of the knee and go down to the seam where the boot break is 

if you’re 5’7 or 5’8 wearing 34” Brian’s, I am 99% sure those are too big for you  

[Max27]

12 minutes ago, Chenner29 said:

if you’re 5’7 or 5’8 wearing 34” Brian’s, I am 99% sure those are too big for you  

thats what i was saying, im a 34 in brians and im 5 inches taller than him lol

[Jonathon v]

41 minutes ago, Chenner29 said:

Based on what you have posted, if your pads sit perfectly by themselves and the thighs are pulling up and away from the ice a bit when you’re in them, I would say it’s because the pads are too big for you. You’re probably landing in the bottom 1/4 of the knee block with all your gear on. 

I’m not familiar with how the blocks install, but can you install them at an angle? Ramp them a bit so the top of the block is closer to the ice and the bottom is a bit further away. This might help offset some of your weight distribution.

get a couple measurements while you’re at it:

 - mid ankle to mid knee along outside of your leg

 - along the backside of your pad, start at the middle of the knee and go down to the seam where the boot break is 

if you’re 5’7 or 5’8 wearing 34” Brian’s, I am 99% sure those are too big for you  

ok thanks. I also have a boot taper, so I noticed when the 5 hole is sealed and the pads are on not being worn, the boot is slightly off the ground. I think when I drop down in my butterfly my ankles/feet push down the boot, and force the thigh rise up. @TheGoalNet or @Max27 do you think this could be the case. Look above at one of the pictures I put of a single pad by itself on the floor, the boot is in mid air

[Max27]

14 minutes ago, Jonathon v said:

ok thanks. I also have a boot taper, so I noticed when the 5 hole is sealed and the pads are on not being worn, the boot is slightly off the ground. I think when I drop down in my butterfly my ankles/feet push down the boot, and force the thigh rise up. @TheGoalNet or @Max27 do you think this could be the case. Look above at one of the pictures I put of a single pad by itself on the floor, the boot is in mid air

the boot is in midair likely bc of the toe taper. if i remember right the genetic 3 is a 80 degree toe. If youre driving your feet as hard as you drive your knees, what youre talking about makes sense about the boot pulling down, which would pull up the thigh subconsuqently. This is more of a concept of the balance of the pad. Check out @Hills (Hockeyreviews.ca on Youtube) he talks about the way the pad sits and if you press on the boot it pulls the thigh up. He talks abt it in his 2s pro and p2 leg pad reviews about how much stability  you get with them

[Jonathon v]

32 minutes ago, Max27 said:

the boot is in midair likely bc of the toe taper. if i remember right the genetic 3 is a 80 degree toe. If youre driving your feet as hard as you drive your knees, what youre talking about makes sense about the boot pulling down, which would pull up the thigh subconsuqently. This is more of a concept of the balance of the pad. Check out @Hills (Hockeyreviews.ca on Youtube) he talks about the way the pad sits and if you press on the boot it pulls the thigh up. He talks abt it in his 2s pro and p2 leg pad reviews about how much stability  you get with them

ill check it out

[TheGoalNet]

16 hours ago, Jonathon v said:

@TheGoalNet   I too am curious to hear what you have to say as you had medium knee stacks on a pad with  little to no torsional flex  (optik) and stiff ones on the gnetik 4 which has lots of it

GNetik 3 is a pretty soft pad with torsional flex. That’s one of the reasons this is happening. 

From memory, the GNetik 3s don’t have any lace connecting the knee block to the pad. That allows some additional movement in the pad that is not ideal. 

From memory, you buy your gear at Jerry’s? Maybe they can mod them and lace them in or hit up Great Saves? That could help with the seal and reduce some of the flex, but that just might be the pads and your butterfly 

When I changed the knee sticks on my 2nd Optik from soft to Hard, that was more about a snap then the thigh rise poking up 

How are you attaching your Pro Laces? Hopefully not with the screws. If your are using a lace to connect the the pro Laces to your bridge, loosen the lace a bit. That will give you a touch of slack, which might help 

[Jonathon v]

57 minutes ago, TheGoalNet said:

GNetik 3 is a pretty soft pad with torsional flex. That’s one of the reasons this is happening. 

From memory, the GNetik 3s don’t have any lace connecting the knee block to the pad. That allows some additional movement in the pad that is not ideal. 

From memory, you buy your gear at Jerry’s? Maybe they can mod them and lace them in or hit up Great Saves? That could help with the seal and reduce some of the flex, but that just might be the pads and your butterfly 

When I changed the knee sticks on my 2nd Optik from soft to Hard, that was more about a snap then the thigh rise poking up 

How are you attaching your Pro Laces? Hopefully not with the screws. If your are using a lace to connect the the pro Laces to your bridge, loosen the lace a bit. That will give you a touch of slack, which might help 

Ok I will try to loosen the skate lace on my pro laces. I’ll give some updates tonight or tomorrow if I remember 

[TheGoalNet]

How did it turn out?

[Jonathon v]

11 hours ago, TheGoalNet said:

How did it turn out?

I put some slack in it And it ended up breaking but off during a practice so I put another lace in with no slack. I think the 5 hole gap IS because of the 80 degree boot taper and the pads are still a bit big on me