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The DEFINITIVE OLD MAN'S REVERTING SKILLS DEVELOPMENT INSTRUCTIONAL VIDEO


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I just watched the entire video. That was awesome. Plenty of details I never knew about stand-up goaltending are included. I enjoyed this goaltender’s playing style. I may have to try some of these. Loved the narration, too. Thanks for posting this. 

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5 hours ago, WillyGrips13 said:

I just watched the entire video. That was awesome. Plenty of details I never knew about stand-up goaltending are included. I enjoyed this goaltender’s playing style. I may have to try some of these. Loved the narration, too. Thanks for posting this. 

Here's a modern EBUG doing it old school. It's a good one :) 

 

 

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8 hours ago, WillyGrips13 said:

I just watched the entire video. That was awesome. Plenty of details I never knew about stand-up goaltending are included. I enjoyed this goaltender’s playing style. I may have to try some of these. Loved the narration, too. Thanks for posting this. 

Well that's the pity of it. We seem to have two formats of goaltending - "modern" and "old school" and it appears a lot of people feel these are two disparate ideologies - just like oil and water, the two will never mix - and "old is mold".

Despite it being "old" and looking clunky, there are still a lot of things that still apply, such as angles (centration) depth, rebound control, stickwork, skating skills...

Sun Tzu's "The Art of War" was apparently written in the 5th century BC, but many tacticians know it and keep a copy of it on their shelves...

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1 hour ago, Colander said:

Well that's the pity of it. We seem to have two formats of goaltending - "modern" and "old school" and it appears a lot of people feel these are two disparate ideologies - just like oil and water, the two will never mix - and "old is mold".

Despite it being "old" and looking clunky, there are still a lot of things that still apply, such as angles (centration) depth, rebound control, stickwork, skating skills...

Sun Tzu's "The Art of War" was apparently written in the 5th century BC, but many tacticians know it and keep a copy of it on their shelves...

Brodeur, Roy, Hasek made careers of mixing both. Fundamentals never change, only concepts and environments.

I have my copy of Sun Tzu's Art of War. It was an interesting read.

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On 2/10/2021 at 11:47 AM, RichMan said:

Here's a modern EBUG doing it old school. It's a good one :) 

 

 

This was great. It reminded me of the “Confrontation” segment on RDS during the 2018-19 season. Basically, like the HNIC intermission showdowns of the 70s. What was cool though is that the last shot for each player was on an “old school goalie” dressed like our friend in the above- with the added twist of the player having to use a wooden stick (which may even have been straight blade, IIRC...?)

It also addresses something that springs to mind about the “old school stand up” style; it cannot be considered in a vacuum, as it wad necessarily a response to skater abilities, tendencies and styles. Additionally, to a point, it was to afford the goalie a small measure of life preservation, given the protective shortcomings of the equipment of the time.

Watch the shooters in the OP video. While acknowledging principles based in math, like playing the angles, does anything about these shooters look like what you see today? Not to my eyes, they don’t. In today’s game where shooters are stopping/starting with lightning quickness, attempting lacrosse goals, and changing shooting angles by shooting pucks with their sticks through their legs and behind their bodies. Moreover, has anyone else noticed how many NHL goals lately are preceded with a “TINK!” as it goes in off the post or bar? Shooters are THAT good now. So how does the stand up/old school style hold up in the face of that, at the pro level, and even what beer leaguers can do if the spend some coin on pro equipment?
 

I’d also argue that it is not a binary “old school OR butterfly” debate here. Rather, a constant evolution where goaltending responds to shooters, and shooters respond to goaltending, on and on and on. It’s easier to pretend we have landmarks, but there are no true and sudden paradigm shifts in goaltending that I am aware of. 

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Thanks for posting, it brings back fond memories. As an old guy (I'm 68) who learned by watching Bernie Parent,  I still occasionally make a skate or kick save, and even rarely a pad stack. I also still come out farther and stay up longer than most goalies which sometimes really surprises the younger guys always going for top cheese. Often these shots bounce harmlessly off my shoulders and chest.

Bottom line is that a modern hybrid style works for me in today's game, but sometimes I can sneak in some of these standup moves...........

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On 2/13/2021 at 9:05 AM, Lucky Pucker said:

I’d also argue that it is not a binary “old school OR butterfly” debate here. Rather, a constant evolution where goaltending responds to shooters, and shooters respond to goaltending, on and on and on. It’s easier to pretend we have landmarks, but there are no true and sudden paradigm shifts in goaltending that I am aware of. 

To avoid being misconstrued, I agree 100% with this. I am only saying that I think there is a faction out there that believes it's either/or, that's the way it's trained and that's the way it's played.

In actuality I define my style as what I consider truly "hybrid*" in that I combine both the old-school and modern butterfly (or at least what my body allows me to physically replicate of b-fly). To use the time-worn analogy, I try to have as many tools in the box as possible and use them as regularly as I can.

*In reality, most people who see me play say I use the 4th style - "desperation"

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So for the fun of it...

Is there a goalie, currently that closely resembles a hybrid style? For me Saros and maybe MAF come to mind. But honestly, the last real hybrid goalie to play was officially Brodeur.

For more entertainment: was Hasek a hybrid or classic goalie?

Argue amonst yourselves :D 

image.jpeg.4ef97a090fc0560a870fadf63f04fcc9.jpeg

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17 hours ago, RichMan said:

So for the fun of it...

Is there a goalie, currently that closely resembles a hybrid style? For me Saros and maybe MAF come to mind. But honestly, the last real hybrid goalie to play was officially Brodeur.

For more entertainment: was Hasek a hybrid or classic goalie?

Argue amonst yourselves :D 

 

If you are dropping question, you are also responsible for parameters: i.e hybrid = 50/50 old-school + modern b-fly? 60/40? Or min 25% of either?

For the record, I consider "old-school" as a primarily stand-up goalie, using depth as his/her primary weapon. Skate and kick saves must be in his arsenal and pad stacks must occur at least every other game.

I don't know if anyone ever really played true hybrid in the NHL - i.e skate save on one shot and drop and b-fly on the next. There was a transitional time, but I can't recall even Brodeur making too many skate/kick saves. He was more of a combination depth-flopper-partial stack goalie and probably the best definition of the  transitional goalie I mention.

As far as Hasek is concerned, pretty sure he didn't know what he would be doing from one play to the next . Sure he won a cup but I can't say I'd ever use his "style" in a teachable moments with newbie goalies...at best as I stated in my last post - desperation.

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On 2/16/2021 at 12:45 PM, Colander said:

I don't know if anyone ever really played true hybrid in the NHL - i.e skate save on one shot and drop and b-fly on the next. There was a transitional time, but I can't recall even Brodeur making too many skate/kick saves. He was more of a combination depth-flopper-partial stack goalie and probably the best definition of the  transitional goalie I mention.

The other Marty, Marty Turco did make some skate/kick saves, stacked the pads, and did the current butterfly.
Also, Chris Osgood morphed his style to stay in the game, so would throw in old school saves with the butterfly as he adjusted his game.

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On 2/15/2021 at 1:20 PM, Colander said:

To avoid being misconstrued, I agree 100% with this. I am only saying that I think there is a faction out there that believes it's either/or, that's the way it's trained and that's the way it's played.

In actuality I define my style as what I consider truly "hybrid*" in that I combine both the old-school and modern butterfly (or at least what my body allows me to physically replicate of b-fly). To use the time-worn analogy, I try to have as many tools in the box as possible and use them as regularly as I can.

*In reality, most people who see me play say I use the 4th style - "desperation"

Hey - I saw the reply, but haven’t had a chance to respond. I always enjoy and value your posts, @Colander - and I especially love your user name! So you were not prone to being misconstrued in my eyes, or by me. 
I think you hit the nail on the head with the tools in the box analogy. While personally I may have just attained the “desperation” style I had aspired to prior to lockdown, the time off has probably busted me back down to “guy who wears goalie equipment while standing/falling down in the vicinity of a net”

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5 hours ago, Lucky Pucker said:

Hey - I saw the reply, but haven’t had a chance to respond. I always enjoy and value your posts, @Colander - and I especially love your user name! So you were not prone to being misconstrued in my eyes, or by me. 
I think you hit the nail on the head with the tools in the box analogy. While personally I may have just attained the “desperation” style I had aspired to prior to lockdown, the time off has probably busted me back down to “guy who wears goalie equipment while standing/falling down in the vicinity of a net”

Thanks for the comments and the benefit of the doubt 🙂. Your last sentence sounds like me when people ask me what position I play in hockey. My standard reply is usually something to the effect of "Despite having all the gear and spending the entire 60 minutes in front of the net, no one has mistaken me for a goalie yet."

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6 hours ago, Lucky Pucker said:

Hey - I saw the reply, but haven’t had a chance to respond. I always enjoy and value your posts, @Colander - and I especially love your user name!

Oh and as for the username - I come by it honestly, A loooong time ago we were sitting in the changeroom after a game and one of the fellows referred to a goalie he knew as a bit of a sieve. He then looked at me and said "don't worry , we'd never call you that - we call you colander when we are sitting on the bench during the game, because it has bigger holes than a sieve"'. I am sure he was just kidding 😢

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