Ankles wobbly after about 10 min on ice

[UCLALabrat]

Ok, trying to get feedback even though I feel like I know the answer here...I wear bauer 2x pros with 3mm steel. I tie my skates as tight as I can, slightly looser down low but ratchet it down as tight as I can at the ankle. When i first get on the ice, my skates are nice and snug and my ankles are locked in. 

After about 10 min, my skates are noticeably looser and my ankles are wobbly as hell. As my legs get fatigued it leads me to catching edges and stumbling, sometimes I go ass over tea kettle. 

Is the answer to find a better way to tie my skates? My skate tongue ends up off to the side (outside on both ankles) and that plays a role.

Or do I just need to develop better leg strength/ankle strength? 

Someone talk me out of buying a pair of konekts

[Chenner29]

Waxed laces and skip the top eyelet?

[Rogie]

Sounds like you need a smaller size skate. Check your sizing. Laces should be snug but not tightened beyond belief. Going to a 4mm blade could help provide some stability but won’t make weak ankles suddenly strong. 
 

Definitely do some off-ice one-leg balance practice/drills. If you can’t do these off ice then you can’t expect to do them in skates. If those are solid, then your ankles are solid and you should be looking for better fitting skates. 

[RichMan]

Before we jump to any conclusions, drop a pic of how your skates are laced up. Then we can help.

If you have your skates laced up normally as per each eyelet, it's only natural that the tight part and loose part will work towards each other to even out.

[Toobs]

Waxed laces would likely help. Also there’s a way to tie your skates by making a locking loop with the top 2 eyelets.

[keeperton]

Going to echo using waxed laces, or you can do a loop of clear-tape around them after tying 'em up, but also to focus on some ankle and leg strength for your own sake here. I don't think you're going to find respite going over to Konekts for this issue if your skates are properly fitted.

Echoing what @RichMan said too. Your skates will adjust over time (almost) no matter what. If you're needing to get slack out of certain parts, or want to crank it down even more, perhaps a skate hook could help you.

[Lucky Pucker]

8 hours ago, Toobs said:

Waxed laces would likely help. Also there’s a way to tie your skates by making a locking loop with the top 2 eyelets.

Ah! This is what I was going to say as well. I also like to have mine cranked pretty tight. IIRC, I got that hack from a post by @RichMan, and have used it ever since (thanks for that, Rich!)

pic to help visualize 

[kohula]

I know this very well, Konekts solved the probrem perfectly 

[Chenner29]

5 hours ago, Lucky Pucker said:

Ah! This is what I was going to say as well. I also like to have mine cranked pretty tight. IIRC, I got that hack from a post by @RichMan, and have used it ever since (thanks for that, Rich!)

pic to help visualize

I'm not a trained PT/movement expert or anything like that, but I strongly disagree with ratcheting down the top laces this tight.

When your ankle is locked in like this, it's incredibly difficult to get the proper ankle flexion you need for a lot of what we do in our role.
It also locks your weight to the back half of the blade/boot; as a result, you will be skating around with your weight on your heels.

Many pro goalies actually skip the top lace.  Here's a really good example of how low Saros can get.

Bob skips the top two!

Below is an action shot which shows why you want that forward flex.
Notice his right skate - the heel is off the ice, his weight loaded into the front of the blade. 

Again, very difficult to load your weight into the front half of your blade if you are cross-lacing up to the top.

[Wake42]

28 minutes ago, Chenner29 said:

I'm not a trained PT/movement expert or anything like that, but I strongly disagree with ratcheting down the top laces this tight.

When your ankle is locked in like this, it's incredibly difficult to get the proper ankle flexion you need for a lot of what we do in our role.
It also locks your weight to the back half of the blade/boot; as a result, you will be skating around with your weight on your heels.

Many pro goalies actually skip the top lace.  Here's a really good example of how low Saros can get.

Bob skips the top two!

Below is an action shot which shows why you want that forward flex.
Notice his right skate - the heel is off the ice, his weight loaded into the front of the blade. 

Again, very difficult to load your weight into the front half of your blade if you are cross-lacing up to the top.

This what the konekts solve for, correct?

[UCLALabrat]

Thanks for the feedback everyone! I'll monkey with the tying arrangement, currently I use a lacing technique similar to the lock loop above where the 3rd eyelet goes up to the 1st eyelet, then crosses through the second eyelet to tie off. Daniel apple recommended this in his videos to give the benefit of forward flex without sacrificing ankle stability.

 

Using that seems to help a bit but thats what has me intrigued with the konekts given they have articulation for better flexion.

 

I'll be in socal in abojt a month and I wanna stop by goalie monkey to try some things. Current skates are the best fitting I've ever had, my toe barely touches the cap and things are nice and snug overall without cutting off circulation. I wear 12.5 so finding properly fitting skates is always a challenge, and the fact that konekts go up to 13 stock also has me looking at them (I wear a 15 shoe).

[RichMan]

@Chenner29 brought forth good examples. 

@UCLALabrat what model skate you wearing? What kind of game you play? How strong are your ankles on their own, like in balance work etc?

[Chenner29]

1 hour ago, Wake42 said:

This what the konekts solve for, correct?

I mean, kind of?

The issue was already solved by skipping the top eyelet(s).

In a way, Bauer introduced it as a problem again because they have the development budget to address it with a new product.

1 hour ago, UCLALabrat said:

Thanks for the feedback everyone! I'll monkey with the tying arrangement, currently I use a lacing technique similar to the lock loop above where the 3rd eyelet goes up to the 1st eyelet, then crosses through the second eyelet to tie off. Daniel apple recommended this in his videos to give the benefit of forward flex without sacrificing ankle stability.

Using that seems to help a bit but thats what has me intrigued with the konekts given they have articulation for better flexion.

I'll be in socal in abojt a month and I wanna stop by goalie monkey to try some things. Current skates are the best fitting I've ever had, my toe barely touches the cap and things are nice and snug overall without cutting off circulation. I wear 12.5 so finding properly fitting skates is always a challenge, and the fact that konekts go up to 13 stock also has me looking at them (I wear a 15 shoe).

Skate fit is deeply personal, and before trying anything new I'd recommend fixing what you've got - especially since it seems like most of what you have is working for you right now.  The Konekt was mostly an experiment in pain for me as the boot didn't fit my foot type.

I'd recommend lacing the bottom of your boot up snug, completely skipping the top eyelet (maybe even two), and crossing your top laces twice before tying tight.
I have never had issues with the top coming loose since doing this myself. It's going to feel weird at first.

tldr; your top laces are coming loose because you are naturally trying to flex into a position that your current lacing method is preventing you from achieving.

[ser33]

I had the same problem as the author and also with Bauer. I have weak, thin ankles and always had to tighten my skates tightly. The problem went away when I switched to True. a rigid boot allows you not to pull the laces with all your might, while providing both fixation of the ankle in the transverse direction and its bending in the longitudinal direction. the examples of Saros and Bob above have one nuance (otherwise the description is completely correct) - they are both wearing True skates. and these particular skates allow you to leave the top eyelets unlaced while providing ankle support. my opinion does not claim to be true

[havlicekdom]

3 hours ago, ser33 said:

I had the same problem as the author and also with Bauer. I have weak, thin ankles and always had to tighten my skates tightly. The problem went away when I switched to True. a rigid boot allows you not to pull the laces with all your might, while providing both fixation of the ankle in the transverse direction and its bending in the longitudinal direction. the examples of Saros and Bob above have one nuance (otherwise the description is completely correct) - they are both wearing True skates. and these particular skates allow you to leave the top eyelets unlaced while providing ankle support. my opinion does not claim to be true

Same experience for me, I had Vapor X2.7 skates for a bit (bought them used for very cheap just so I could get back into the sport) and my ankles felt weird no matter how I tied the skates and would get loose during games even with waxed laces. Switched over to CCM and combined with the locking loop, courtesy of @RichMan , they fit like a glove now.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't Bauer skates notorious for having wide ankle area?

[RichMan]

5 hours ago, ser33 said:

I had the same problem as the author and also with Bauer. I have weak, thin ankles and always had to tighten my skates tightly. The problem went away when I switched to True. a rigid boot allows you not to pull the laces with all your might, while providing both fixation of the ankle in the transverse direction and its bending in the longitudinal direction. the examples of Saros and Bob above have one nuance (otherwise the description is completely correct) - they are both wearing True skates. and these particular skates allow you to leave the top eyelets unlaced while providing ankle support. my opinion does not claim to be true

It is true that True skates are stiff as heck, even the entry model. 

Wearing a stiffer boot will act as a splint on your ankle, giving it extra side support but it shouldn't replace having stronger ankles altogether. Soft boot or stiff boot, ankle injuries can still happen. Working with elastics (north/south, east/west) and standing on semi-soft foam block can be very beneficial in the process. Consider it an added insurance should a skate become loose for whatever reason. 

I appreciate the love for the lace loop lock method. Clearly not my invention but it one of many solutions one can try to remedy the issue.

Last week I tried the "skip the eyelet" approach (again) midway to take away lace bite. This time I skipped 2 holes. I might have well just stepped on the ice without laces as that's how they felt. I couldn't move all out since there was little support. Good thing my ankles were strong enough to handle the stress.

Couple days later I tried it again but this time only skipping one hole. I couldn't dial my lacing equally, one skate was tight, one was loose.

I'm just gonna go back to full on lacing but I only pull till snug, not tight. It's comfortable and it gives me ample flex. I wear Bauer 700X btw. I might try skipping the top eyelet to see if it's worth it for me. 

[coopaloop1234]

18 hours ago, Chenner29 said:

Many pro goalies actually skip the top lace.  Here's a really good example of how low Saros can get.

I started skipping the top eyelet about two years ago and it's been such an improvement on my skate feel and ankle mobility. 

I used to have a ton of issues with being a "Goldilocks" with my skates, skipping the top eyelet not only allowed me to get better ankle flex, but it made the whole process of tying my skates up incredibly easier. 

It takes a few skates to get used to the lack of support up high, but it's such a benefit that I'm with Chenner in really wanting to pound the drum on how good it is. 

[DL42]

its called runner's heel loop or lock.

 

It locks down the heel.

 

if u do it one down instead of at the top and put a option b strap on the top, it gave the same flexibility to bend the ankle.

 

 

[UCLALabrat]

Sorry for not getting back yesterday, might have time for some pics later today. Here's the method I've been trying:

gives lateral stability in the ankle (which I want) plus forward flex in the stance. What I'm trying to avoid is lack of support side to side; I think just abandoning the top eyelets would exacerbate this problem when my legs are fatigued.

 

 

[RichMan]

3 hours ago, UCLALabrat said:

Sorry for not getting back yesterday, might have time for some pics later today. Here's the method I've been trying:

gives lateral stability in the ankle (which I want) plus forward flex in the stance. What I'm trying to avoid is lack of support side to side; I think just abandoning the top eyelets would exacerbate this problem when my legs are fatigued.

 

 

Saw it some weeks ago but haven't tried it. It's a different take from what Ben Scriven had suggested and clearly far different from the runner's lock method.

If your ankles are still wobbly while using his method, then it could very well be an ankle strength issue.

If things are still getting loose, try to loop twice instead of just once when doing the final tying. I'll try to find a pic or video. This for me not only prevents loosening but it also gives a hands free approach during the end, so I don't have to go all pretzel like with my fingers to tie them up.

[RichMan]

FYI...tried the Bob lace-up method tonight and it was a tad odd but got comfortable real quick. The forward flex was awesome. Just make sure you have even tension throughout the skate when you try it. Once again, my right skate was a tad looser. I can never get that shit right for some reason

[RichMan]

7 hours ago, RichMan said:

FYI...tried the Bob lace-up method tonight and it was a tad odd but got comfortable real quick. The forward flex was awesome. Just make sure you have even tension throughout the skate when you try it. Once again, my right skate was a tad looser. I can never get that shit right for some reason

Small update. My ankles are a tad sore this morning. Is it just last night's skate or in combination with my trail run Tuesday night...maybe?

Do your strengthening exercises kids

[UCLALabrat]

So I was actually doing the lacing technique slightly wrong (going top 2 eyelets instead of 3) so I'll try out the right way tonight. Seems a bit looser that way but the flex is marginally better.

[johncho]

19 hours ago, UCLALabrat said:

So I was actually doing the lacing technique slightly wrong (going top 2 eyelets instead of 3) so I'll try out the right way tonight. Seems a bit looser that way but the flex is marginally better.

I tried the 3 like in the vid, but now I do the top 2, and I'm absolutely in love with how it feels and how much flex it gives me.

[raidersgoalie]

I had the same problem to. No matter what I did it always loosened up.  So I got some gel ankle sleeves. Solved all my problems. Also takes the pain away to. But I might get some true goalie skates. The ankle was so snug and comfy. So I won’t need the gel sleeves if I get the trues.